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6220

Put Ubuntu on a laptop with better specs

6220 points posted to Inspiron products, Linux by piratehead 10/16/07 **PARTIALLY IMPLEMENTED**

Offer an Ubuntu laptop (Inspirion or otherwise) with available discreet graphics, discreet audio, 8GB or more of RAM, a quad-core processor, bluetooth, next-gen WiFi, and integrated webcam.

I don't know how many of those are possible at this point, but each one is a step forward for people who are waiting on certain specs to bite on a Dell laptop.

Now that you offer laptops with Ubuntu on them, I really don't want to go to another company just to get the computer specs I want. I wish to vote for Dell with my dollars, paying for a laptop that has actually been tested and certified by the manufacturer to run Ubuntu. Please give me the opportunity!


Check out the Idea in Action to find out more about our Ubuntu offerings.

jmxz
10/17/07		 It's worth noting again that Michael Dell has a very nice Ubuntu Dell Precision M90. It's not up to the specs you requested; but it's one heck of a lot better than what they offer to the general public today. Would that satisfy you?
winoffice
10/17/07		 This idea is a duplicate of dhart's idea "Pre-Installed Linux | Ubuntu | Fedora | OpenSUSE | Multi-Boot", which asks for offering Ubuntu on all PCs.
aikiwolfie
10/18/07		 Anybody would think Dell would be getting the message by now that we want to be able to choose which OS we want irrespective of the model. Personally I'd like to see Ubuntu on the new tablet when or if it ever gets released.
jmxz
10/18/07		 winoffice
It's not a duplicate.
The other idea is asking for Ubuntu (and other OS's) on all models.
This one is asking for one high-end OS on one high-end PC.

Earlier dell_admin1 had recommended more specific ideas requesting particular models.
Re: no OS on other models - you might want to pick a model you'd want to see added to Dell's n-series, and then post an idea specifically saying that. (unless you already have) Just a thought.
Presumably the more specific requests help Dell prioritize their efforts.
winoffice
10/21/07		 jmxz
I do not agree, and Ubuntu is not a high-end OS.
aikiwolfie
10/23/07		 It's not? What would you call a high-end OS? Ubuntu runs perfect on an XPS 700.
winoffice
10/23/07		 aikiwolfie: Windows Vista.

Just because Ubuntu runs well on an XPS 700 does not mean that it is high-end in my eyes.
jmxz
10/23/07		 winoffice:

Vista high-end?!? LOL!!!!!!

Note that there are exactly zero Vista systems on this survey
http://www.top500.org/stats/list/29/os
which is practically the definition of "high end" systems.

Ubuntu uses the same OS (kernel) as the dominant high-end OS in that list (Ubuntu has prettier user-space eye-candy than those on that list; but it's still uses a high-end OS).
piratehead
10/23/07		 Ubuntu runs just fine on high-end PCs; it can make use of many processor cores, many gigs of RAM, lots of hard drive space, powerful discreet graphics and sound cards, and other features of high-end PCs. The fact that Vista can also accomplish that is irrelevant to Ubuntu users and irrelevant to my request; what I want to see, specifically, is a business-class Ubuntu laptop on offer with a high-end hardware available.
winoffice
10/24/07		 jmxz:

Now it is you who makes me LOL!!!!!!

I thought that you would understand why Vista is not on that list - I did at once. Vista is not included because this survey concerns supercomputers, and Vista is simply not intended for use on supercomputers. Nor is it intended for servers or mainframes - it is intended for non-servers, also known as PCs.

Windows Server Compute Cluster 2003 is included in the list - but note that it has the word "Server" in it, so it is intended for servers, mainframes and supercomputers, but Vista is not (it is Windows, but not Windows "Server"), and thus it is quite clear why they are not in the same list.

Also, note that the XPS 700 (the system that aikiwolfie mentioned) would not be classified as a supercomputer, mainframe or even a server in the eyes of Dell. Actually, this idea has nothing to do with servers at all - the list that you mentioned talks about supercomputers, and you are not about to use a laptop (this idea talks specifically about "laptops") as a supercomputer, are you?

So I think that it is pretty obvious to you that I meant high-end as in PCs, not high-end as in supercomputers, as the list that you mentioned.
jmxz
10/24/07		 The important attribute of high end computing that seems relevant here is an OS that lets you get the most out of your hardware. Vista tends to make even a relatively powerful machine act sluggish by consuming most of the memory for itself; and apparently consuming much of the CPU resources just to move around all the memory it consumes. When I buy a high-end workstation, it's because I want _my_ applications to take full advantage of the hardware - not have them consumed mostly by the OS while choking my applications. The OS's on supercomputers excel at this - making the most efficient use of the hardware available.
neffscape
10/25/07		 YES!!! Please give us a laptop xps 1530 with ubuntu preinstalled! I beg youuu!!!
aikiwolfie
10/25/07		 winoffice are you aware that Microsoft like Linux developers uses the same kernel in it's desktop and server OS iterations. The difference between Linux as a server and Windows as a server is pretty much the same. Prettier UI and more user friendly features. Ubuntu Linux is every bit a high end OS. More so than Vista.
ustolemyname
10/26/07		 1650x1080 res screen + nvidia graphics card
(the option was there, but I wasn't prepared to buy into version 1.0 of anything)
nominoe
10/31/07		 Yes, i want a vostro with ubuntu
rkl
11/06/07		 I presume those specs are for a few years time - 8GB RAM?! Quad core processor for mobiles doesn't even exist yet! N-standard for 802.11 hasn't been ratified either... Mind you, all of this is irrelevant to UK users now that the Ubuntu laptop has been ditched by Dell - see: http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer/news/2007/11/06/dell-dumps-ubuntu
aikiwolfie
11/06/07		 No it hasn't. The web page is just broken. Dell admin said so in another thread relating directly to that problem. The Inquirer is a tech pages equivalent to the Sun or the Daily Star. It's trash. Period.
winoffice
11/29/07		 piratehead: "Offer an Ubuntu laptop (Inspirion or otherwise) with available discreet graphics, discreet audio, 8GB or more of RAM, a quad-core processor, bluetooth, next-gen WiFi, and integrated webcam."

So far quad-core processors and 8 GB of memory are not available on any laptop (including Windows laptops) so the status of this idea is between **NOT LIKELY** and **NOT NOW**.
jervis961
11/29/07		 Actually there are companies offering quad core laptops, just not Dell.
aikiwolfie
11/29/07		 At the very least they are rare. Few people really need quad core at the moment.
winoffice
11/29/07		 Quad-core processors exist on laptops????

jervis961, please find us a laptop with a quad-core processor.

Anyway, 8 GB of memory is not yet available on any laptop (including Windows laptops) at all events.
jdelidc
11/29/07		 8g of ram!? wow.... i thought ubuntu worked great with just 512m. but it would definitely be a sweet machine if it could be done
jervis961
11/29/07		 http://www.xtremenotebooks.com/index.php?section=configurator®ular_model_i...
jmxz
11/30/07		 @jdelic: "8g of ram!? wow.... i thought ubuntu worked great with just 512m. but it would definitely be a sweet machine if it could be done"

Ubuntu runs fine with 512m; but there are some very memory-hungry applications that benefit from having more (firefox can grow to multiple GB if you set it to cache aggressively; sales demos involving running VMWare with more bloated OS's inside; large Oracle databases).

And yes, 8GB is useful for a notebook too. With Linux and enough memory, you can load your entire OS disk to RAM so you never have to spin up your hard drive saving power for a long flight (some of the Knoppix distros use this trick).
aikiwolfie
11/30/07		 It's called a RAM disc. It's a technique that's been around for a while. Since the days OF MS-DOS. Probably longer but I'm not that old. It's more commonly used for OS installation setups though. Even Microsoft use it. Live Linux distros also use it.
jmxz
11/30/07		 aikiwolfie:
Yeah.
The part that I hadn't seen before knoppix was chrooting to the ram disk after setting it up so the boot media can be powered down and even removed.
aikiwolfie
11/30/07		 I used to do it with MS-DOS boot floppies. It just makes life a whole lot easier when you don't have to access the floppy all the time. Knoppix has a live distro heritage so it's not surprising that they're using this technique.

What I would like to know is how they manage to get large heavyweight applications like OpenOffice or Compiz-Fusion to work with live distros right off the CD. That's some seriously clever memory management going on. Normally something like that would be making heavy use of the swap partition for memory paging.
mrcynical
11/30/07		 8Gb of RAM on a laptop? I'm not sure Dell offer _any_ laptops, even with Windows, with that spec.
adams484
12/01/07		 As a business case there really isn't a lot to talk about here. Dell is in the business of selling computers and Ubuntu appeals to two classes of users. The budget conscious user and the power user. If Dell is going to sell PCs with Ubuntu installed it would make perfect sense to provide a high end choice or choices.
aikiwolfie
12/01/07		 Why does Windows have to come into it. This is about getting the most from a Ubuntu based laptop. A Windows configuration is irrelevant.

@ adams484. Your absolutely right. Advertising Ubuntu with the base system Dell are offering is pointless. Nobody other than budget users will want such a system. But Dell claims it's aiming at enthusiasts. As I've said on another thread, enthusiast buy kit like the XPS range. They don't generally buy bargain basement word processors.
ubondell
12/02/07		 I'll turn this around slightly and say that Windows users tend to two groups: People that aren't that computer knowledgeable, and the hardcore gamers. Everyone else could use Linux as easily as Windows, and if they did use Linux, they would realize that they could be saving a couple hundred dollars when you factor in that you can get the same performance from not so bleeding-edge HW and that the OS is $0. Of course, that last bit of savings is not available since a Windows version, not the OS of your choice, is preinstalled, along with a bunch of other salesware, when you buy a PC. Using Linux on that lower power HW will also save them an amount equal to the purchase cost in about 2 years compared to what you need to run Vista for example.
jervis961
12/02/07		 ubondell - there is another group of Windows user out there. I'm not a hard core gamer and far from a novice but still use Vista out of preference. I don't like Apple's OS and think Linux needs to be more user friendly before it is a viable option. I support Linux's development because I see it as the future of computing, I'm just not ready to use it exclusively at this point.

Dell needs to give the people who are comfortable with Linux better options than last years models and low end parts.
ubondell
12/02/07		 @jervis961 - I agree with you to a point. My point is that the two groups I listed will be the last to leave the Windows party. By your comments it sounds like you are in the "I would consider Linux, except for ..." group. I was in that group too, but after dual booting for a while I realized that there were fewer things that I needed to use Windows for, and with a little researching on the Ubuntu forums I found solutions to each of them. That is the huge difference between Windows and Linux that I see. On Linux, and that is a general statement because I find solutions suitable for Ubuntu on the Gentoo Linux wikis, the help is freely available. That is not the way it is on Windows. I have looked for Windows drivers in the past. All you get to are subscription sites that ask for sign-up before you know if there is anything useful. On Linux the full explanation is there directly.

I am curious what you see as Linux's lack of user friendliness? I hope it is not the occasional command line, because I find that unlike Windows, the Linux command line is a powerful alternative to a bunch of GUI hacks. Maybe that's because I grew up using command line OSes that predated Linux and know my way around shell programming. BTW, I am not a SW guy, but have hacked a couple of Linux apps to make small changes to make them work better for me, and I wouldn't classify myself as either budget conscious or power user.
aikiwolfie
12/02/07		 @jervis Ubuntu 7.10 (Gusty Gibbon) is more or less every bit as user friendly as Windows XP. People seemed to do just fine with XP. Not only that but there is massive community support should people get stuck with anything. I have personally just created a thread over on Ubuntu Forums showing people how to mount NTFS partitions from an Nvidia strip raid 0 array.
jmxz
12/02/07		 In defense of @jervis's comments [though I haven't really used XP or Vista much so I can't really make a fair comparison] -- Ubuntu on Dell laptops (even the ones they pre-install) have a few really glaring usability issues. The upgrade to Gutsy forgetting the display's capabilities that were working fine on the Dell-pre-installed Feisty comes to mind. Sure it's easy to fix (dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg); but surely that doesn't count as friendly.

Now As I said, I haven't really tried XP or Vista; but I'm guessing that if you "up"grade XP to Vista, it wouldn't forget your display's capabilities. Or would it?
aikiwolfie
12/02/07		 The Gusty up grade worked fine on my XPS 700. One more reason to use more powerful systems I guess. I just clicked the upgrade button and it downloaded everything without a fuss.
jervis961
12/02/07		 ubundell - nobody enjoys having to search for ways to fix an OS especially for things that should be included like proper software to watch a DVD.

jmxz - Vista remembered my display capabilities.
aikiwolfie
12/02/07		 To be fair, getting DRM crippled DVDs working in Ubuntu Gusty Gibbon is as easy as installing any other application. And VCL is legal everywhere so far as I know. So the legality isn't even an issue anymore.
ubondell
12/02/07		 Since I don't have a DVD in my laptop I watch DVDs on my DVD player and big screen. I found it much more important to have gcc and perl on my laptop but I obviously do different things with it than you do. I'm still waiting for a good reason why Dell won't let people buy any laptop with Ubuntu, or without an OS if they choose.
aikiwolfie
12/02/07		 Well they won't be able to sell you their "customer we don't care" packages if they do.

The bottom line is Ubuntu does everything Windows does. Ubuntu runs on decent and even high spec systems. Customers like us want the choice.
jervis961
12/03/07		 I agree aikiwolfie and hopefully the added exposure will put the pressure on part manufacturers to make drivers for Linux.
aikiwolfie
12/03/07		 A more picky approach to buying parts is all that's needed. If Dell really have a serious desire to break into the Linux desktop market, and their plans for China suggests that they do, then they should be using Linux friendly suppliers as often as possible. That alone will provide the desired change.
jmxz
12/03/07		 @aikiwolfie: "I just clicked the upgrade button and it downloaded everything without a fuss."

Funny thing is that it *almost* worked for me. Just the GUI screen resolution menu items no longer listed 1680x1050; and they claimed it was a "Generic Monitor". Yet dpkg-reconfigure xorg worked fine and gave me my resolution back.

@aikiwolfie: "One more reason to use more powerful systems I guess."

And, ironically, it worked flawlessly on less powerfull Dell systems I work with too.
Of the Dell computers around me, it worked on the Dimension 4550, the Dimension XPSR350, and the Inspiron 7000.

Just not the E1505N which Dell sold with pre-installed Ubuntu.
aikiwolfie
12/03/07		 LMAO!!! Is the E1505N part of the Dimension line? XPS are just Dimensions with a fancy name. It even says Dimension on my invoice. Maybe the Dimension line are just generally more compatible? But matt_d did actually explain why some displays lost their settings during the upgrade. Something to do with the monitor list not being kept up to date or something like that. I can't remember which thread it was though.

Linux defaults to Generic Monitor to protect your system and you. I'm not sure what happens with LCDs but in the past selecting the wrong setting with CRTs could actually cause them to explode as they overloaded. So at least the safeties work.

I had a narrow escape once at college when the stupid woman next to me used the wrong settings. There I was minding my business going through my multi-user OS administration module when I hear this annoying really high pitched whine. At first I thought it was just a natural side effect of sitting next to a woman and she was just talking to me. As it turns out she'd set a monitor capable of a maximum refresh rate of 60Hz to refresh at 75Hz. The 90s were so much more exciting. Things exploded if you did it wrong!
jmxz
12/04/07		 It's the Inspiron laptop - the only one they pre-installed with Ubuntu at the time I got it - which makes it that much less acceptable that they didn't talk to Canonical about getting the display on the list. It happily identified my old external Dell D1226H CRT monitor, tho. Just not the darn display attached to the laptop on which Dell bundled Ubuntu.

Re: "The 90s were so much more exciting".
Oh yes. I remember having to unplug cards to read what chips were on them to get X11 working.
aikiwolfie
12/04/07		 I've seen me doing that for Windows 95! I feel old now. :o(
jmxz
12/04/07		 aikiwolfie:

Old? Back in what I think of as the old days we had no such issues because the VT100s mostly just worked.

Back then I and my employers liked the newfangled computers running Ultrix and HP/UX so much better (than the TOPS-20 on the PDP10s that I was used to) that I pretty much missed out on Windows; (except for brief encounters with my brother's PC's Limited [note that that company later became Dell] PC/AT clone). Too bad it only had a 80286 CPU or it'd be running Ubuntu now too :).
aikiwolfie
12/05/07		 You found a PC Ubuntu doesn't run on! Blasphemy! ... What's a VT100? Are you the wise old oracle?
jmxz
12/05/07		 Yeah - I still have that 286 computer and an Apple II; neither of which support Ubuntu. And though I think you know this, but for the younger folk, a VT100 was perhaps the most popular old terminal that people used to hook up to mainframes. I think it's where a lot of conventions like 80-column-wide text came from. The relatively popular program "xterm" is an emulator of it's successor the VT102 and fancier VT220 that was capable of vector graphics. The wise old oracle? Not me - I don't go far enough back to remember punch cards or tubes. I recall from another thread that one of the frequent posters here's history goes back even further than mine.
aikiwolfie
12/05/07		 "

VT LAN40



In February 1995, Digital announced the VT LAN40, a colour windowing network terminal. This device was a diskless PC, containing Windows 3.1 in ROM, and supporting up to eight terminal sessions over LAT, DECnet, TCP/IP or serial line, using TD/SMP. The system box and mouse had a suggested list price of $890. It connected to standard PC keyboards and monitors."

And to think there are people posting on IdeaStorm today that think a major rethink of PC technology would be needed to achieve a diskless PC. As I said to those folks. It's already been done. And we're still begging Dell to do it!

Yes I've used those terminals or ones like them when I worked for NS&I. But I thought they were really old. Like from the 50s and 60s old. I never realized they were almost new! LOL Seriously freaky how fast the pace of change is in IT.
winoffice
12/05/07		 jmxz: "The important attribute of high end computing that seems relevant here is an OS that lets you get the most out of your hardware"

I did not mean high-end as in hardware. I said that Vista is high-end primarily because of other features (a new "high-end" interface; OS installation is finally no longer text-based, and so on). How can Ubuntu be "high-end" to most users (users like me) when OS setup is to some extent non-GUI? Windows Vista setup is fully GUI.
aikiwolfie
12/05/07		 Uh what? winoffice that is just bull. The standard Ubuntu setup is entirely GUI based. The whole thing from start to finish. The only time you'll ever see a text based installation is if you use the "alternative" CD or deliberately choose to use text mode. Which I'm not actually sure is possible with standard Ubuntu.

Now if you look at the MS web site for administrator tools. You'll see that the most powerful stuff is all console based. That's right it's all still text based. The only time I've ever had to use the command line with Ubuntu is for administration tasks. Nothing else.

Now as has been mentioned before Ubuntu is a high end OS. It does all the same party tricks Windows Vista can pull and more. It can even do these things on less powerful hardware. If you like Vista and want to use it that's fine. Go for it. But stop deluding your self and stop with the lying.
ubondell
12/06/07		 My favorite 'party trick' to show how powerful the Linux shell can be is this. In one line I can give you a list of all the duplicate pictures in your photograph collection

> find /home -type f -iname "*.jpg" -print | xargs -n1 cksum | sort | awk 'BEGIN{pck=""}{if($1==pck)print $2;pck=$1}'

Voila! On Windows you need to buy some $100 GUI application to do that. It probably ran 100X faster on Linux, too, and needed only built-in tools.
aikiwolfie
12/06/07		 I just ran that. It didn't work. All I got was "no such file or directory" LOL! But it's a good point none the less. The Linux command line is phenomenally powerful. But most new user will never use it to it's potential. Another interesting thing about Linux GUI apps is that they aren't actually full applications. They're just user friendly front ends to the command line.
winoffice
12/06/07		 Well I saw in a book about Ubuntu that the setup was text-based....

I am sure that many powerful things and administrative tools in Ubuntu are also text-based, just like Windows.
aikiwolfie
12/06/07		 In a book? LOL ... Books in general are out of date before they are printed never mind a book giving info on an OS that's on a 6 month development life cycle. There are two new Ubuntu releases every year. Remember Ubuntu comes in "Live CD" form.

With Linux, the GUI is often just a front end to the command line. Linux users don't have any beef with using the command line. It's often the most efficient way to do things. Assuming you know what your doing. And if you don't then you shouldn't be using those commands.

But you need to remember the Linux command line is nothing like MS-DOS or Windows console. It's a totally different beast. Entire programs can be written directly on the Linux command line. That's how powerful it is. That is a high-end OS.

The closest Windows gets to the power of the Linux command line are batch files and shell scripts.
ubondell
12/06/07		 Hmm? Probably you have a lot of directories and files from Windows that you have imported with non-Unix style names (i.e. full of spaces). That would need this slight change to pass the filenames as NULL terminated strings, like C uses:

find /home/joeuser -type f -iname "*.jpg" -print0 | xargs --null -n1 cksum | sort | awk 'BEGIN{pck=""}{if($1!=pck)print "";print $3;pck=$1}'

The above line is exactly from the history buffer in the xterm I ran it (minus the line break that ideastorm added). There was one mistake in the awk call. I forgot that cksum returns the filesize between the checksum value and the filename. I also changed it so that it only searches your user space (assuming your username is 'joeuser') since it wouldn't be nice (no pun!) to run that command on a Linux system with a few hundred users.
ubondell
12/06/07		 BTW, I have to give credit to http://ubuntuforums.org/ since that is where I discovered the find -print0 | xargs --null trick. It was in a topic about cloning a partition over another one. The ubuntuforums.org site and those like it (http://gentoo-wiki.com is another great one) are resources that have no analog in the Windows world. There aren't many Linux issues that you can't find a solution for on those sites, and if you did then you can just post a request and someone will probably answer.

The Linux community is like that. I found a bug in the evince (open-source PDF reader) and I posted a bug on it. I got a nice email reply from the evince team leader that thanked me and told me they had already fixed it in a version that hadn't been pushed out to the Ubuntu package repository. They suggested that I try it to see, but I just waited for the new version to appear as an update from Ubuntu and sure enough the problem (actually pretty minor) was gone. I am sure that I would have gotten the same level of response from Adobe or Microsoft. LOL!!!
ubondell
12/06/07		 @aikiwolfie - Here is another experiment to try on a Linux system using the power of the shell vs the wonderful GUI of the high-end OS of your choice: Add 100 new users to your system. On my Linux system I could run this from the shell (aka command line):

sudo cat file_with_a_list_of_one_hundred_usernames.txt | awk '{print $1,$1}' | xargs -n2 adduser --disable-login

Using a GUI I guarantee that you would get mouse fatigue before you were done. I can't imagine managing a system with tons of users without having a powerful shell and the ability to go into superuser (i.e. administrator) only when I need to.

@@akiwolfie - Please to not run that one as a test!!
aikiwolfie
12/07/07		 LMAO!!! Ok I won't run it. But I'd just like to second the comment about the Linux community. It was an invaluable resource for me when trying to figure out how to us dmraid with an nvidia fake-raid 0 array. All though there were lots of examples for dual booting to such an array I couldn't really find exactly what I was looking for. All I wanted was a simple mount command with the right options. But i couldn't find it. But I did find enough information to Frankenstein my own solution.
jmxz
12/07/07		 ubondell: "Voila! On Windows you need to buy some $100 GUI application to do that. It probably ran 100X faster on Linux, too, and needed only built-in tools."
aikiwolfie: "The Linux command line is phenomenally powerful. But most new user will never use it to it's potential. "

Once those users start coming to Linux in volume I see a great opportunity in writing some thin GUI wrappers around ubondell's shell scripts and selling them for $110 to guys like winoffice who think GUIs are more "high-end".
aikiwolfie
12/07/07		 LOL and who said there was no money to be made in FOSS.
ubondell
12/07/07		 @jmxz - I'm glad you liked that command line. If I was going to GUI-ify it I would use Perl or maybe Python, and run it using a browser. That way you could even display the images!

@aikiwolfie - You sound like someone like me that knows there has to be a way to fix any problem in Linux by looking for the explanation of one of the "gurus" that's already been there. Of course we have one advantage over people trying to do these things in Windows. We can resort to looking at mount.c, if need be!
aikiwolfie
12/08/07		 Actually I think the greater advantage is that we're not afraid to mess with the system. Of course that sometimes gets me in trouble. But if I hit a brick wall I go looking for the solution on the net. I don't waste my money on call centers. 99% of the time call center staff are reading off a script and don't actually know what they are talking about. I'm not about to take advice from someone who doesn't know what they are doing.
jmxz
12/08/07		 @ubondell: "I'm glad you liked that command line." and earlier "sudo cat file_with_a_list_of_one_hundred_usernames.txt | awk '{print $1,$1}' | xargs -n2 adduser --disable-login"

Though I do have to wonder about why your username text file needs root access, yet your adduser perl script seems to be suid root. :-)
I think it'd have been perfectly safe on aikiwolfie's test system.

But seriously, yes I liked it quite a bit. And regarding your "I also changed it so that it only searches your user space (assuming your username is 'joeuser') since it wouldn't be nice (no pun!) to run that command on a Linux system with a few hundred users." - actually I'm finding it (or a variation that does a first pass checking file sizes before doing more expensive checksums) useful on a system with a few hundred thousand users - a friend's image hosting site I'm helping with; finding identical background images and seriously considering symlinking them to a shared image.
aikiwolfie
12/08/07		 LOL my test system is my main system. Don't go breaking it or I'll have to go back to Windows. Seriously I haven't logged into Windows now for so long. I dread logging in again. Everything will go nuts trying to download updates all at once. My system will be unusable for about 5 million years.
jmxz
12/09/07		 aikiwolfie:
For a while I only ran Windows once/year because I couldn't find any tax software for Linux and didn't have access to a mac.
Now if I'd need Windows outside of work I suppose I still have the old Win98 partition lying around from last time I got a computer that came bundled with it.
aikiwolfie
12/10/07		 In the UK HMRC has a web based application which suits my needs. So come April I won't even need Windows for my tax return.
piratehead
12/16/07		 I'm really glad that this idea has gotten so many comments!

I am reading a lot of reactions like "8GB of RAM? 4 processors? No way! You can't expect that for Ubuntu machines when even Windows doesn't have it yet!"

The primary purpose of this idea is to encourage Ubuntu laptops with hardware that is as cutting-edge as the software. We can't afford not to be forward-thinking in this regard: laptops will double in RAM and processing cores eventually, and my vote for the idea signifies my wish that, when it happens for Dell, Ubuntu is on a level playing field with Windows, not restricted to the technology of yesteryear.
aikiwolfie
12/16/07		 Considering Dell aren't willing to let it's customers easily compare Windows and Ubuntu systems by selling them side-by-side as Tesco does, I say the spec of a Windows PC doesn't even come into the argument. I don't see why Ubuntu should be limited by Windows in any way shape or form.

I think Linux users have become so used to sitting in the shade some of them actually go looking for it. Well not me. I want the best hardware Dell can sell me and I want to run Ubuntu Linux on that hardware. Not as a secondary OS as part of a dual boot setup, but as the only OS installed on the system.

So far as I'm concerned Windows just doesn't come into the discussion here.
winoffice
12/16/07		 But honestly piratehead, it truly is impossible to expect a Ubuntu laptop with 8 GB of memory now. There is currently no such Windows laptop either.
ubondell
12/17/07		 That 8GB PC would need to run a 64b OS for obvious reasons.
aikiwolfie
12/17/07		 Not a problem for Ubuntu. It comes in 64-bit and no stupid upgrade coupon needed either!
jmxz
12/17/07		 ooooh an Idea. "Dell should offer an upgrade coupon to go from 32-bit Ubuntu to 64-bit Ubuntu that has the same dollar-value as the one from 32-bit-vista to 64-bit-vista"
jmxz
12/17/07		 @ubondell: "That 8GB PC would need to run a 64b OS for obvious reasons."

And what would those obvious reasons be?

... http://www.sybase.com/detail?id=1030009 ...
However, Linux provides a window of virtual address space that keeps moving over a shared memory file system, allowing 32-bit applications to address more than 4GB of memory.With ASE 12.5.2, DBAs can now configure up to 64GB of memory for data caches on a 32-bit Linux platform.
aikiwolfie
12/17/07		 Go for it jmxz. Post that idea.
ubondell
12/18/07		 OK, so I'm a HW guy, but still there is a limit that no single application can access more than 4GB, or am I missing something here? I mean a pointer would still only cover a 32b address range. Right?
jmxz
12/18/07		 @ubondell:
Yeah - but Intel x86 has long supported 36-bit address lines; and some kinda convoluted page table logic to get to the extra 4 bits.
If any given application doesn't need more than 4GB, it's not that big an issue, because IIRC the OS messes with the page tables on a context switch anyway. It seems really memory intensive applications like sybase apparently have logic to mess with such page tables to access more than 4GB apparently in a single process.
...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Physical_Address_Extension
winoffice
Jan 11		 @aikiwolfie: "Uh what? winoffice that is just bull."

Uh what? aikiwolfie that is just nonsense. This idea has nothing to do with bulls. Or are you talking about an IdeaStorm user with such a screen name?
winoffice
Jan 11		 jmxz
"It's not a duplicate.
The other idea is asking for Ubuntu (and other OS's) on all models.
This one is asking for one high-end OS on one high-end PC."

It is a duplicate, since it is a repetition of what has already been asked for. Why it is a repetition: The other idea asks for Ubuntu on all models, true. But there is certainly no reason or need to ask for Ubuntu on a specific model once it has already been asked for on all models.
jmxz
Jan 11		 @winoffice: "But there is certainly no reason to ask for Ubuntu on a specific model once it has already been asked for on all models."

On the contrary, on May 15 Dell-admin1 wrote "Re: no OS on other models - you might want to pick a model you'd want to see added to Dell's n-series, and then post an idea specifically saying that. (unless you already have) Just a thought." -- essentially asking for specific model requests presumably to help prioritize the over-general existing requests.
toojays
Jan 14		 I would like to see Ubuntu available on the Vostro 1200.
winoffice
Jan 14		 @jmxz: Well it is "Just a thought" so the specific requests are not just yet "officially" non-duplicates of the general requests.
abj32
Jan 20		 Those specs are high enough as is, BUT ON A LAPTOP?!?
winoffice
Jan 20		 jmxz:

"Vista tends to make even a relatively powerful machine act sluggish by consuming most of the memory for itself; and apparently consuming much of the CPU resources just to move around all the memory it consumes."

Nah - that's not true. I own a Dell Inspiron XPS Generation 2 notebook PC (which is a powerful machine by the way). It is running Vista Ultimate and is by no means "sluggish".
jdelidc
Jan 20		 the cpu part ain't true. but the rest is. the cpu is almoast always dead board because it's waiting for the hard drive. edit: part of that has been fixed in SP1
kara_k
Jan 23		 Changed status to **IN PROGRESS**.

Check out the Idea in Action!
jdelidc
Jan 23		 that helps (but doesn't finish) this idea too.... http://www.ideastorm.com/article/show/66672/Sell_Linux_PCs_Wordwide__not_only...
matt_d
Jan 24		 Thanks to everyone who voted for this idea. Your enthusiasm and persistence is what drove us to add Ubuntu to the XPS M1330n.
jmxz
Jan 24		 @matt_d: Thank You matt_d, kara_k, and everyone else involved at Linux at Dell.

I would have bought one of these things if I hadn't already bought a laptop earlier this year (a Dell Ubuntu E1505N the first week you started selling them).

I almost wish you guys had a trade-in program where I could upgrade to this one.

Now waiting for your quad-core Linux desktop/workstation with room for 4 hard drives and reasonably quiet noise levels. I'll probably buy one of those the week it comes out if the price is competitive with your windows ones (unless another vendor offers similar first).
aikiwolfie
Jan 24		 Ya know I might be tempted to buy a tablet if it came with Ubuntu :oD
piratehead
Jan 24		 This is a good outcome! It's great to see Ubuntu on one of Dell's best laptops.
aikiwolfie
Jan 24		 It's an excellent outcome. Dell are very very slowly getting there. Now if matt_d mutinies and takes over we might get things done faster. kara_k can be his trusty side kick.
libertyshadow
Mar 5		 The USA Member purchase site needs to offer the Nvidia card on the M1330N
kara_k
Mar 5		 Changed status to **PARTIALLY IMPLEMENTED**.

Check out the Idea in Action update.
aikiwolfie
Mar 6		 So um can I have my remote control for my M1330n now please kara :oD kthanx :oD
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