There should be an option of having no trialware on all computers

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There should be an option of having no trialware on all computers

21940 points posted to Software by jervis961 08/23/07 **REVIEWED**

Here is a news article about trialware and how Dell feels that regular customers want it but small business ones do. Do they not look at the ideas here?

"Not interested in all of the trial software that clutters up new PCs? You're not alone: According to Dell's recent research in both focus groups and broader surveys, small-business users overwhelmingly view trialware as an irritant, not a benefit. That research has led Dell to axe the extras from its new Vostro line of small-business desktop PCs and laptops. Eliminating demo applications is a major step for Dell, which has caught flack for the quantity of trialware on its consumer PCs. (One frustrated customer went so far as to develop a "Decrapifier" utility. The company says that consumers who buy PCs for personal use do express interest in preloaded trial software, but that small-business users have different needs. By eliminating the trialware from Vostro machines, Dell says it has cut the system setup time in half. For now, Dell is the only major PC manufacturer to ship small-business systems without preinstalled trialware as a standard practice. (Some competitors, such as HP, allow customers to choose a no-trialware configuration.)"

Dell offers a broad amount of software choice and minimal software shipped. Read jeremy_f's post on the options we give our customers

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jervis961 08/23/07	I know that .chris but since they are not listening to the home customers I thought I would alert people to it.
dell_admin10 08/30/07	Still want to keep this separate from http://www.ideastorm.com/article/show/62715/Preinstalled_Software_Must_Be_Opt... ?
jervis961 08/30/07	are they going to impliment it on ALL computers ????
jervis961 08/30/07	you can merge it into that one if you are willing to merge them both into my idea that they are both duplicates of' @DUPLICATE OF http://www.ideastorm.com/article/show/61894 SEE # 3
dell_admin10 08/30/07	I get your point, that is why I asked. The idea will not be merged now and your points will be preserved. :)
jervis961 08/30/07	So why can some ideas get merged and not others? My idea came first, did it not? Hell you could combine a lot of the site into my one idea and save space. :)
dell_admin10 08/31/07	Merging is a tricky business and really not about saving space. :) We are working towards a standard for merging that involves the opinions of admins and the whole Idea storm community.
jervis961 08/31/07	OK it was a joking comment anyway. I'll let you get back to work, thanks for stopping by. :)
winoffice 08/31/07	This is a duplicate of ootleman's idea "No Extra Software Option"
jervis961 08/31/07	http://www.ideastorm.com/article/show/61743/No_Extra_Software_Option sure merge it into that one if they merge http://www.ideastorm.com/article/show/62715/Preinstalled_Software_Must_Be_Opt... into it also.
dell_admin1 09/06/07	Changed status to UNDER REVIEW.
stijepan 09/24/07	In "ideas in action" they sayd that for US they will put an option were you can get no trialware, but what about other countries. I'm from Chile, and i don't have that option, that i would like very much to have. Thanks pardon me if i didn't wrote some word well.
jdelidc 09/24/07	good point. "all computers" should include the ones in other countries, not just america
jervis961 09/24/07	That was the thought behind the idea, maybe I wasn't specific enough. :)
mudkiller 09/27/07	The option should also be free! If Dell still wants to install trialware, Dell should give you can some kind of discount for letting them install the trialware...
uue 10/07/07	I completely agree, the dell computers come with waaaay to much pre-installed software.
dwood 11/01/07	I dont want a program on my computer unless it is the FULL version and wont keep asking me to buy a new one!
jdelidc 11/03/07	amen
cosmichellion 11/07/07	If it's not a full version then don't even bother putting it on my system. I know what I want on my system and am very capable of buying it when or if I need it. The previous mention of putting an option to include trialware is a good start but the keyword there is "option". For the most part, we've had no choice. Don't just do it for small-business, enterprise etc...Also include HSB. A lot of individual home users don't want that clutter either.
jervis961 11/07/07	Exactly cosmichellion. Dell uses the lack of trialware as a selling point for business customers but don't seem to think the home user should have a choice.
aikiwolfie 11/08/07	I personally tried to remove just about every bit of the pre-installed crapola Dell shoved on my system. I'm now getting ready to dump Windows almost completely. If anybody from Dell is reading this let me make it very clear. I am a home user. I do not want trial-ware! None of it! Nothing! Nada! Zilch! GET IT!
suyoggupta 11/09/07	I have seen Dell putting Beta versions of Google products... this is very risky and unethical... Betas are not the final products and may be they are not supported by the company who made them... beta is for techie minds who are ready to risk their machine's stability... I am doubtful about the real intent of this phrase 'no trialware...', do you mean to say dell is still free to put non-trial crap in the machines...? Did you mean to say that you dont want even a single bit of unwanted crap on dell machines...?
aikiwolfie 11/09/07	What really bugs the dell out of me is the way things seem to be set up. When I uninstall something from my account it seems to magically reappear if I make a new account. Very annoying.
dwood 11/09/07	cluster a "decrapifier" (clusty.com) Google is overrated.
sugarbear 11/09/07	You beat me to it. www.pcdecrapifier.com
aikiwolfie 11/10/07	Nice. I'll check it out.
spannerzone 11/11/07	Even my Vostro came with McAffee 1 month free 'tralware' I consider installing antivirus probably the most annoying 'trialware' of the lot as it's often hard to remove and leaves potential problems (especially if it's a Symantec product!) Please can Dell simply supply 1 CD or folder on the desktop full of trialware for the end user to install as they see fit.
sugarbear 11/11/07	@spannerzone, I suggest you look at http://freegrisoft.com/doc/2/ This a a very good program with the ability to auto update and scan. It works on Vista and older OS`s. There are some other free anti virus out here available, I just prefere this one. They have a free anti rootkit remover that is decent.
aikiwolfie 11/11/07	Tried pcdecrapifier. It's not as good as I hoped. I want PC TuneUp for free!
dwood 11/11/07	AVG has a great Anti-Virus but im on Linux so it truly doesn't matter for me ;p
aikiwolfie 11/11/07	I wouldn't get too cocky. Linux isn't as impervious as some like to make out. In fact there was a proof of concept virus written that could run in both Windows and Linux environments. It didn't actually work at first. Then the god of Linux Linus Torvalds (sp?) himself got hold of it and fixed it so it would work. Linux currently doesn't suffer from viruses because Windows is the primary OS in the PC market and a lot of people have a grudge against Microsoft. Criminals also target stupid people and stupid people use Windows.
mwillcox 11/14/07	I had to call Dell today about an issue I was having with the Google Desktop on a new computer at work. While the tech and I were talking, he told me about this site. I think this is great - I would love to see the trial software either removed entirely or optional for those that do want it. Dell can custom build, so why not add the trial software onto that as an option. I personally have had issues with some of the trial software (especially on my personal laptop with Windows Vista). I don't like having the trial versions of AOL, Earthlink, etc. also because I don't use them and it's just one more thing I have to uninstall. Please remove the trial software.
sugarbear 11/14/07	Welcome mwillcox, I hope you enjoy and learn on this site. It can be quite fasinating.
dwood 11/15/07	and they just leave stuff on your registry which never goes away and unless you are an advanced user, you cant get rid of it.
sugarbear 11/15/07	You said a mouthfull. It`s a good thing there are some good reg. cleaner programs. I use reg. Mechanic, but advise the average person to use ccleaner.
premcv 11/15/07	CCCleaner is a good software that I have used previously, now I use the Registry Mechanic. Like how RM works.
aikiwolfie 11/15/07	The Windows registry is something I hate. I use PC Tools Registry Mechanic to compress and optimize it.
sugarbear 11/15/07	I shortened what I typed earlier. I put reg. mechanic, It is PC Tools. CCleaner is really safe for the average user that has no business in the registry. It only removes certain things. Where as reg. mec. you have to watch what you take out.
aikiwolfie 11/15/07	LOL ... hmm ... I just tell it to kill everything!
premcv 11/15/07	Yes, I do that too!
dwood 11/15/07	I need to seriously clean my registry (I think it takes up some 5 gigs)
dwood 11/15/07	man, Jervis must be reaking the points from this idea.
jervis961 11/15/07	Yeah its doing well for me. Did you read the comments near the top when they tried to merge it on me. I won that debate too.
dwood 11/15/07	I see that. If someone made an idea after you, then it should just be deleted, not merged.
premcv 11/15/07	LOL, yea dwood. No more merges.
jervis961 11/15/07	But the merge gives you the points. The idea they wanted to merge this into is like the #2 most voted on idea(or something like that). So I was willing to let them merge this one into it (it was older than this one anyway) but threw in the stipulation that they should both be merged into my other idea which is older than both. I could get about half the site merged into that one. http://www.ideastorm.com/article/show/61894
dwood 11/15/07	I see that, after a short skim. I believe you on the CS part the most strongly.
aikiwolfie 11/15/07	A 5 gig registry? i hope you never reboot that machine? Does it take a long time to start?
dwood 11/15/07	no, but I havent checked it in a loooooooooooooooooooong time.
dwood 11/15/07	(and I was joking, too)
dwood 11/16/07	Double Post Of partially implemented idea.
pablopecora 11/19/07	We have the RIGHT of choosing what to install or not, I don't even want to have the icon of some trial software...
dwood 11/19/07	I know. I cant get AOL off my system....
aikiwolfie 11/19/07	Actually I think the Utility partition is where this stuff hides. Think I'll have a look later.
dwood 11/19/07	That might be useful, looking and all.
spacegy4 12/02/07	people need to understand that you would need to pay more money to get a computer without trialware because that is one of the ways that dell makes the big bucks.
aikiwolfie 12/02/07	Couldn't access the Utility partition? It appears as a boot option in the boot menu (F12 after turning the PC on) but it just goes directly to Windows if selected? Any Dell type person care to explain?
nsenman 12/02/07	Totally agree. My m1330 came with the trial bloatware and as soon as I removed all of it my performance was 50% faster.
thomasp94 12/17/07	There should be NOTHING on the systems when they arrive other than the operating system and drivers! I bought a new insperon laptop the other day and I spent the first 2 hours after unpacking it, removing tons of junk programs.
huifei 12/18/07	haha
dwood 12/18/07	muahaha
carsonmetcalf 12/22/07	Dell is the worst computer corporation on earth! I've had so much bad luck with them, I finally made the switch to HP. Faster and much more RELIABLE! People who use Dell have to be out of their mind. I have had 3 Dells. One for 2 years, one for 2 weeks, and another one for 5 days! Please, go somewhere else, anywhere else but here!
gregorybe 12/25/07	I DO NOT have a problem with installed software if DELL gets some money for it so a pc can be cheaper. In that case no problem uninstalling the software for a cheaper pc
seasideclown 12/26/07	Dell has actually improved a lot with this. You can now choose to not have microsoft works, and security trialware.
steve123 12/27/07	Yes, i do not want Norton or McAfee installed, the first thing i do is uninstall ! Give me an option not to purchase them over and over when i never use them......
plinky Feb 3	I asked dell when i ordered for a clean hard drive and thats what shipped. I wanted Roxio and Adobe and thats it. Three days later thats what came. Seems if you order by phone (and even online gives you options) all you have to do is ask.
sirdazzle Feb 7	If anybody from Dell is reading this let me make it very clear. I am a home user. I do not want trial-ware! None of it! Nothing! Nada! Zilch! GET IT!
jackie_c Feb 7	@sirdazzle: We are reading it! Welcome to IdeaStorm!
yaknowwat Feb 16	The Major thing I suggest is not Pre-Installing AntiVirus's. The Major brand AntiVirus risk the machines stability and purposely do not fully uninstall themselves as to bring more sales to themselves because of virus they leave behind that are basically activated on uninstall.
aikiwolfie Feb 16	Major anti-virus software developers are deliberately infecting PCs? That's an incredibly serious accusation. In fact in the UK and the US they would definitely be breaking the law. Do you have proof of this? What virus are activated?
yaknowwat Feb 16	The Major Offender tends to McAfee whom seem to do a lot of foul play. Norton is mainly bloated that is my only real concern with it though. Though I've done a bit of uninstalling before a major thing is after unistalling mcafee it is still there i can find traces of its dll's registries setting etc still on a system. Mcafee goes ahead and admits they steal information from open source software with no regard for GPL licensing. It would be nice if Dell got a partnership with ESET I know it may be hard but, it would really be a great thing. ESET's NOD32 its the 2nd strongest AV behind BitDefender but uses very minimal resources (ESET Security suite uses around 30 MiB [AntiVirus around 20MiB] and nearly no processing power.) I would like to suggest Comodo Firewall (that now is open to OEM distrubution if you license with them.) but, I realize it is a freeware application and gaining profit from it would be a no go. Basically my suggestion isn't quite get rid of trialware but instead choosing better trialware as I know Dell makes a nifty profit off the trial programs they offer.
jdelidc Feb 17	that's a bug. not a virus. a virus has to have a way to duplicate itself
aikiwolfie Feb 17	I've uninstall McAfee my self and it's true it does leave things behind. It even leaves a process running. But that's still not a virus. At best it's spyware. Which isn't exactly illegal. If you're going to accuse a company of breaking the law then you have to be able to back it up.
yaknowwat Feb 18	yes spyware/malware realm smacks self in face why did i type virus (I know its meaning.) anyways point is that McAfee never address's the fact they leave things behind taking advantage of Windows design that doesn't track where files go on an install.(as far as I know it doesn't) Either way it messes up your computer slows it down then gives some people the feeling they wish they had an AV.
aikiwolfie Feb 18	Well to be honest Linux can only track where things were installed if you use a package manager. Other than that it's up to users or administrators to track where files and applications were installed. Distributions like Ubuntu have the /opt directory for manual installations. But there's no actual enforcement in place other than the read/write restrictions for important directories. I can just as easily create my own directory either on / if I have the password or in my home directory. Windows of course has it's own global and local directories for programs. I don't think either system has any specific advantages or disadvantages over the other.
jdelidc Feb 18	fedora is horrendous with uninstalling things. leaves tons of stuff behind or will take too much stuff with it. windows actually has the best uninstall system that i've seen, even if it leaves stuff behind
yaknowwat Feb 18	@jdelidc: I haven't tried fedora before only thing I can think of is an install that is compiled or bad package manager. Windows uninstall system is not a good design depending on a program to create its own uninstaller can be very flawed (this makes it so that the installer can choose not to make an uninstaller or the uninstaller can become malicious.) even before I knew about linux i disliked the design of the windows uninstaller. Then again people have their opinions, its just when something is "uninstalled" it should be uninstalled.
aikiwolfie Feb 18	Synaptic is better than the Windows system. It's very good at determining dependencies and informing the user about what can and can't go. Windows Add/Remove programs I feel is a bit redundant. At least in XP. Even when it is tracking what's been installed, it can't do anything unless the programs own uninstaller is available. Most of those then go and leave stuff behind. Fedora uses the RPM package system which is a nightmare. Dependencies aren't tracked properly leaving users to go hunting all over the web for missing files. Welcome to the RPM "bad fire".
jmxz Mar 22	Ooh - more progress on this idea: from Sony. Cool! I knew IdeaStorm would have an effect. Good to see someone (Sony) is reading this and getting things implemented. Also interesting that "removal of... applications, trial software, and games" is a $50 option from Sony; which gives a ballpark figure of how much those adware vendors pay to get their stuff pre-installed.
jmxz Mar 22	And already an update - Sony responds fast to ridicule Breaking: Sony Won't Charge $50 To Remove Bloatware Responding to a tidal wave of outrage, Sony has reversed a plan to charge $50 to remove all the pre-installed applications — often derided as "bloatware" or "craplets" — from its high-end TZ-series notebooks. Earlier today, PC World reported that Sony would charge $50 for a configuration option called "Fresh Start," which would not include the bloatware. When contacted by Gadget Lab, a spokesperson for Sony said that the company will now remove that charge. "There will be no charge for Fresh Start," said the spokesman. ... "Which would you rather deal with: Loss of revenue or loss of customer satisfaction?"
aikiwolfie Mar 22	Good to see Sony doing something right for a change. I wonder if Dell will follow suit now someone else has done it?
surfbrat Mar 22	I am new here because I searched for "computers no preinstalled software" and I am SO glad that so many others feel the same way as I do. My computer runs sooo very slowly and I tried to look to see what processes are running and I have no idea what my computer needs and what is background stuff that came on my computer. You all impress me with your knowledge of registries and the like, I messed up one computer(a little bit) by trying to bring it down to bare bones. I would love to buy a new computer that was "all mine", just me and MY stuff!
aikiwolfie Mar 22	A computer that's all yours? Just you and your stuff? You'll need to a Linux system then. You get away with an Apple if you want something more mainstream. But Vistas EULA grants Microsoft the right to intrude on your privacy at any time. XP as we all know has been consigned to the scrap heap. Dell are now selling some nice Linux based PCs. Check out their open source page on Dell.com
surfbrat Mar 22	I apologize for being naive, my four kids usually keep me from learning anything except stuff that's on Spongebob these days....Linux is an operating system, I take it.....(unfortunately I'm blond, this isn't helping our cause, is it?) What makes it different? If you don't mind taking a minute...
aikiwolfie Mar 22	That's okay I'm blond too. ;o) Yes Linux is an operating system. Or rather a number of operating systems based around the same core components. For consumers Dell offers Ubuntu Linux. Ubuntu is now easily the most popular version of Linux for normal people who aren't rocket scientists. It's very easy to use and set up. It has someway to go on the multimedia side of things and there aren't many commercial games available for Linux. But you can do all the normal day to day stuff. E-mail, brows the web etc. If you buy one of Dells open source PCs you also get LinDVD for watching DVDs which is really helpful for the novice Linux user.
surfbrat Mar 22	Sounds perfect, all my photos and videos are sitting in folder untouched anyways. You said that there aren't many commercial games available, but are there applications for spreadsheets, wordprocessing available? I was looking and was going to choose the upgraded video card, but perhaps that would be $90 wasted if there aren't many games available....the stock card is probably decent anyways. Is there any issues with compatibilty with printers and other peripherals? Thanks for helping out....the guy I usually ask about this stuff works for MSoft so I think I've been carefully steered away from anything non MS!
aikiwolfie Mar 23	There are plenty of applications for spreadsheets and word processing. OpenOffice.org will even give you some Microsoft Office compatibility if you need to convert anything. With printers and peripherals it's all about the drivers. There are some issues. For example i think Dell still haven't released a printer driver for Linux. Most HP printers amongst others will work though. Lists of compatible hardware are easy enough to find. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupport http://www.linuxcompatible.org/compatibility.html http://www.linuxquestions.org/hcl/index.php
surfbrat Mar 24	Thanks! and sorry to everyone for deviating from the topic of the section!
aikiwolfie Mar 24	It's cool surfbrat. We're always happy to help.
jervis961 Mar 24	No need to say sorry.
jeremy_f Apr 10	Software choice falls into two buckets for consumers: - When ordering XPS systems, almost all software is defaulted to ‘no software’ - When ordering Insprion systems, customers have the option to remove software prior to ordering (on almost all software) Additionally, we have a software uninstaller application (it’s found within the category folders on our Desktop) that assists in removing any unwanted installed software. On Direct2Dell you can learn more about how Dell’s approach to software choice and shipping minimal software (Dell and Bloatware, 2007 and No Bloatware Please ). Also, it’s good to note that systems we offer through our retail partners might come with more software than systems ordered directly from dell.com.
jervis961 Apr 10	So I guess this is about to be marked as reviewed.
aikiwolfie Apr 10	Okay. Why not make no software the default for everything and then let consumers add what they want. That would be far more consumer friendly and much simpler and what your consumers actually asked for. Not this halfway house copout.
jervis961 Apr 11	They claim that most people want antivirus and some other things. My point has always been what if I already have a program? Why force me to uninstall something? Also why have different base configurations for different models? Shouldn't they all start out the same?
kara_k Apr 11	Changed status to REVIEWED.
jervis961 Apr 11	For my next prediction......
jmxz Apr 11	@jervis961: "They claim that most people want antivirus and some other things. My point has always been what if I already have a program? Why force me to uninstall something?" Apparently many systems get infected during the time that the anti-virus installer takes to run. By having one pre-installed it gives you the time you need to safely install yours.
nyclatinlefty Apr 17	It would be a good idea for Dell to offer the options of either having trialware on their computers, on having certain trailaware, or having no trialware installed on their computers.
aikiwolfie Apr 17	Most systems get infected in the time it takes for the anti-virus installer to run? What a load of bull! I don't believe that for a second. But if it's true then all the more reason to use an OS that doesn't leave all it's networking ports open to the net by default.
jmxz Apr 17	@aikiwolfie: "Most systems get infected in the time it takes for the anti-virus installer to run? What a load of bull! I don't believe that for a second. But if it's true then all the more reason to use an OS that doesn't leave all it's networking ports open to the net by default." Perhaps they've improved - but here's the paper I was referring to. For two weeks (September 9 to September 23, 2004) security researchers did the following experiment: http://www.avantgarde.com/xxxxttln.pdf This experiment tests to see how well commonly used computer platforms withstand Internet attacks in the wild. The experiment quantifies the amount of time it takes for a computer to be attacked and compromised when placed on a live network for the very first time and qualifies the type of attack method used to successfully compromise a computer over a two week period A Windows Small Business Server 2003 computer lasted an average of 8 hours. A Windows XP SP1 computer lasted an average of 4 minutes. XP SP2 survived longer - probably because it was pretty new at the time and hackers didn't yet have time to develop and automate the exploits yet.

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